PROCEEDINGS HELD BEFORE THE BALDWIN COUNTY COMMISSION
(Work Session)
Tuesday, April 27, 2010

COUNTY COMMISSIONERS PRESENT:

Charles "Skip" Gruber
Frank Burt
David Bishop
Wayne Gruenloh

ALSO PRESENT:

Scott Barnett, Esquire
Michael Thompson, County Administrator
David Brewer, Assistant County Administrator
Connie Baggett, Mobile Press Register

10 - DISCUSSION OF 1-10 SERVICE ROAD

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: If I could, Mr. Chairman, while Cal --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: -- is still here -- It's not on the agenda, but as it relates to -- to Highway and the 1-10 service road, you know, last meeting we withdrew that from going out the bid for it and -- and ceasing to work on -- on the service road.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Yeah.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: I'm concerned with -- We've got -- and as Commissioner Burt mentioned -- we've got
agreements with a number of other parties with regards to that. And I'm -- I'm concerned as far as what kind of position we've
put those other parties in. And I'd like the Highway team and -- and Cal to meet with the City of Spanish Fort and -- and Cypress Equities and -- and maybe even the hospital, but have a conversation with --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: -- with regards to that, if you don't -- don't mind. I don't know what will come of that. But I'm -- In a conversation I had with -- with someone from -- from one of the council members at Spanish Fort, I think they may have had some of their agreements references to the -- the service road. Now, I -- I'm sure it's taken them awhile to analyze that to see what impact our decision might -- might have. And I also wanted to find out -- I think Cal's been talking to AL DOT to find out, as far as the interchange, what the status of -- of that might be.

MR. CAL MARKERT: Yeah.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: So, if you don't mind,
I want us to set up a Highway meeting to --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Yeah.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: -- discuss that.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: A Highway meeting.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: What Highway meeting,
though? You know, they took an action, whatever action it was.
And I thought we defined it there, that we threw the whole
project out. And we do have agreements there that we've
entered into with Daphne for a million dollars, their offer
towards the project match, up until the first of July; is that
right, Cal?

MR. MICHAEL THOMPSON: Yeah.

MR. CAL MARKERT: Right.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: And Cypress Equities to
the end of August; is that correct?

MR. CAL MARKERT: Right.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: So those, and the -- the
TimberCreek Land, or whatever it is, LLC, that was two million
dollars. And that was up to the end of August, wasn't it?

MR. CAL MARKERT: Yes, sir.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Okay. So, you know, we
need to -- It seems to me, we had an agreement. Then we said
we threw the whole project out and ended the project. But it
left those agreements dangling.
Now, I don't know how the engineer can meet with those
people and determine that. Those are legal questions, I would
think. And, of course, I've heard from Fairhope and -- I mean,
from Daphne and Spanish Fort, you know. They wasn't -- I know
the mayor wasn't very pleased, of Daphne, but still their
council had voted unanimously and handed us that thing there
without regard. Of course, I think they just rescinded their
resolution or whatever it was before. They still had a signed
agreement with us that obligated them for up --

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Right.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- to a million dollars,
if we got it going. So I just assume that our Legal Department
was -- and theirs were already looking at those things. They
may have even already talked. I don't know. But I haven't
talked to any of them.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Well, if they have, I
haven ' t --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: I know they're upset.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Well, if -- if Legal
has been -- been talking, I haven't been made aware of that.
And -- and certainly Scott and Legal would be involved in -- in
any meeting we had. But I think we ought to have a
conversation with them to -- to -- to find out what kind of
position we've -- we've put them in, Mr. Chairman.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: But it should be out in
the open where the public knows, too, shouldn't it? I mean, I
don't want no private meetings with them on the side.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Well, you have to have
Finance Committee meetings. So I don't understand why Finance
can but Highway, two Commissioners can't be with other folks
and talk about items and bring them back to the Commission. I
don't understand.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Well, I don't understand
what you're trying to do. Are you trying to bring the project
back to life? Is that what it is?

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: I don't know
whether --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: It'd bring it back
to life because you'd be --

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: No. I think what it --
what -- what the point of the thing that I'm seeing is like the
people in Spanish Fort -- And in all due respect, they
didn't -- they weren't at the meeting. And I think what
they're trying to see is if there's anything, you know, like
from the council members mentioned about discussing, you know,
possible what might or may be still possible from their end of
the road, you know, from the west end. And that was what I
thought about it. I mean, and then what you were talking about
on the west end, I don't think they're wanting to talk to get
some clarification on that end.

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: Mr. Chairman, just -- just so
you'll know, we haven't had any formal meetings with the
lawyers. I've anticipated a meeting on several subjects with
Daphne's lawyer. And this was one of the topics that I was
going to broach with him this -- this week, tomorrow as a
matter of fact.
And the -- and TimberCreek Land Company's lawyer and I
have been playing phone tag. But we've been trying to set up a
meeting for several days now concerning a couple of different
subjects, this being one of them. So just FYI, that's --
that's the extent of what we've done toward that effort.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

MR. DAVID BREWER: And we've -- although we've
looked at the documents there, that's -- that's the stage of
the meeting process. The -- Keep in mind, these -- these
documents that were in place with these three entities were
funding agreements primarily benefitting the County if the
County were to -- to go to bid and start the project and so
forth. So the primary obligation went away. The -- the money
went away when the County decided they abandon the project. So
I hope that answers -- answers that.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: One question is what's a
formal meeting? Is that a sit-down meeting where our Legal
meets with their Legal or is that telephone conversations or
e-mail conversations? What sort of -- What's a formal and an
informal meeting?

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: I -- I -- all I thought
it would be was something like a Road and Bridge where --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: No. He said he talked
about he hadn't -- Legal hadn't had any formal meetings.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: Oh, I see.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: What other kind of
meetings do you have?

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: Right. I used that word --
obviously, I used that word loosely. The -- the -- What I'm
talking about is a formal meeting, sitting down to discuss
exactly --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: That's --

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: -- that subject and --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: SO -'-

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: -- and determine where we go
from there. That hasn't occurred.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Right.

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: The -- What we're going to do is
just broach the subject with each other and just -- just talk
through the basics. And -- and that -- that was combined --

MR. MICHAEL THOMPSON: At this point, you've just
reviewed the --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: SO --

MR. MICHAEL THOMPSON: -- agreements?

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: So you haven't had any
e-mail conversations or telephone conversations? I'm just
trying to find out.

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: Not about this subject, no,
not --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Directly.

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: -- not particularly, not
directly. The --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: I --

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: -- discussion was going --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Through a third party or
something?

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: No, I mean directly -- I mean,
directly about this exact subject, for that purpose only.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: I'm not sure I understand.
But, okay.

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: No specific conversation has
occurred between the lawyers on these subjects. We've --
we've -- we've been trying for days to meet so that we can do
that.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: Well, you will let us
know and keep us informed. And we'll --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Well, I think some --

MR. SCOTT BARNETT: Yes, sir.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- some representative
from the Commission absolutely ought to be at that meeting when
Legal meets.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: You've got the Road and
Bridge Chairman right here.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Well, the Finance Chairman
is the one we're talking about. And I absolutely think -- And
I -- and I'd just as soon it was out in -- in the public,
myself. I mean --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay. Y'all want
to let Scott arrange something so that the --

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: I'm fine with that,
Mr. Chairman. And if these two gentlemen can go without it
being a conflict or a beach of the -- any kind of open meeting
laws, I mean, they're -- Two people can meet.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Well -- well, I don't --
Why are we --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Well --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- trying to do it --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Well --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- behind the scenes?

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Well, you're not
doing it behind the scene.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: We did all this other out
in the open.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: It's just like when
we tried to meet with our Legislators, they're not going to
want to meet --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Okay.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: -- in open public
and discuss this. I don't think they will. The --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Okay.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: They might. I
don't know.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: I -- Whatever they want
to do.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: But I think --

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: I mean, you know, if
they want to have --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: I don't know. If y'all
are trying to bring the thing back to life, then --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: I don't think it's
a matter of bringing --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- well, here it is, I
guess.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: It's not a matter
of bringing it -- the project to life. I think it's a matter
of giving the courtesy to those folks that were -- had a part
in it to have their say, even though it's, you know, may be a
dead subject. But at least they'll have their say --

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Well --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: -- and I think
that's it.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- you know, and that's
what I've tried to point out. It's all over and done. But at
that meeting, when all the -- packed the house out there to
leverage us, when some of those people who stood before us, I
know, knew the actual true facts behind the case. And -- and
they still went on and threw this thing out, when Cal says he
didn't have two weeks of -- of time in there to play with and
we kicked it out and stopped him from what he was doing
And -- and now, we -- we only got until the end of -- the first
of -- until the end of -- first of July --

MR. MICHAEL THOMPSON: First of July.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- for the -- Daphne's
million dollars. And to get this thing cranked back up
again -- I'm telling you, AL DOT is highly upset in Montgomery.
Now, if y'all haven't made contact, I have. And because
the first thing I wanted to do is apologize to them. Because
we've made so many trips up there, had them shift their
projects around and shift money around and make this a priority
item. And we've worked on it for all this time. And then just
to throw it out without even talking to AL DOT was, you know --
And I know they've been our friend in this, to try to make it
happen because they knew it was needed.
And -- and, you know, the Commission made a mistake, I
believe. But I voted against it. And that's the way it was.
And I'm not trying to play that up again. It was just a grave
mistake by not considering all the other parties that had been
involved in it just so a hundred and fifty folks could get
their way, and some lawyers.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Mr. Chairman, you
know, at -- at the meeting I was on the record stating that I
felt like there was some things that were unknown, that I had
not had a chance to talk to -- to the City of Spanish Fort. I
had not -- had not had a chance to talk to -- to the -- to the
hospital and -- and, you know, what their situation was. We
had not had conversations with AL DOT at that point in time
You know, it appeared to me that last Tuesday, it wasn't
quite right. You know, we -- we withdrew. You know, I want to
go back and -- and -- and address some of the -- the loose
ends, you know. As far as, you know, coming back to life, you
know, I'm not even thinking along those lines. But I think we
had agreements in place. I want to talk to some of those --
those people.
I'm concerned. If we put Spanish Fort in a -- in a
precarious position, you know, I want to know what -- what that
is and are there alternatives. Is there some way else to -- to
look at it.
You know, if -- if we need to go back and apologize to AL
DOT, certainly I would be willing to apologize AL DOT. My hope
is they'll continue with the diamond design. And it -- You
know, there might not be a service road now, but there might be
ten, fifteen, twenty years down the road, if that -- if the
Commission, at that point in time, sees fit to -- to consider
or the City sees fit to consider it.
But, you know, if that needs to all be done in an open,
public meeting, I'm fine with that. I didn't see this to the
point to where it needs to be in an open, public meeting. It's
simply a conversation with them much like when we were putting
the agreement together with them in the first place --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Yeah.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: -- that the
Commissioners were -- were involved in --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: All sit --

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: -- all this being --
all this being the -- the same thing. There's no effort there
to do anything other than simply try to find out where we are,
you know, where are the other parties that were involved in , this.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Mr. Chairman, just one
thing. The agenda that was before us and the action we would
have taken at last Tuesday's meeting would not, in fact, have
done anything except kept it moving, if you'd have passed it.
It would have made a bunch of folks out there and some lawyers
mad. But -- but -- but that's all it would have done. It
wasn't an absolute, you know, fire the gun on the project. It
was to go out for bids.
And we go out bid at times and not -- not do the project.
And -- and if we'd have gone on ahead, then it would still be
moving. Now, we're trying to catch back up, it seems, and
cover our tracks and deal with it. But, anyway, that's all on
the record. And I just wanted it said since you brought it up.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: All right.

COMMISSIONER WAYNE GRUENLOH: Thank you.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: Mr. Chairman, I'll make
one final comment.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: And then I'll shut up;
and that is, that I don't think that a discussion with Spanish
Fort and -- and the Infirmary -- Which, all I know is they got
out of the project. And that, to me, was something that
affected the project. But the council and then Spanish Fort
if somebody can have a discussion with them and see what they
have to say about it, if they ever want to see the west end of
that road done, I -- I think there still could be life. I
mean, I don't know. But, I mean, I -- I don't see the other
part of it being alive.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: Mr. Chairman, the hospital
never put up a dime in the project. They said they couldn't
from the beginning. Spanish Fort didn't put up anything.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: Okay.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: They said they couldn't
fund it. So the only people that put up money and was in
agreement with was Cypress Equities, who said it was of major
importance to them; and Daphne, who said it was of importance
to them for the future of Daphne and future healthcare, whether
it was -- Anyway, whatever it was.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: But they never did --

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: No.

COMMISSIONER FRANK BURT: -- agree to put up any
money, so they weren't part of the project.

COMMISSIONER DAVID BISHOP: Okay.

CHAIRMAN CHARLES "SKIP" GRUBER: Okay. All right.
Let's -- The next item is Item D-1. Cal, do you have anything
else?

MR. CAL MARKERT: That's it.